The other extremists 14

I subscribe to the RSS feeds of a few reactionary bigots. They’re good to quote when I want to show how stupid some people’s arguments are and their reality-free beliefs can be amusing.

Admittedly, calls for Gordon Brown to be tried as a traitor because he made a bad financial decision (particularly after fantasising about stringing up “traitors”) don’t seem so funny after Friday’s events in Norway. I don’t think that Stewart Cowan- the quoted blogger, who wants treason redefined around his evidence free conspiracy theories- is going to take up arms against a sea of secular humanists any time soon, but there exist in this country those who might.

Let’s not forget that the UK’s biggest cache of weapons and chemicals hoarded for terror purposes was held by a bunch of white racists, that before 7/7 probably the worst bombing campaign on the mainland was carried out by a racist homophobic idiot (and before that it was the Irish) and that just last year a white racist was jailed for trying to mix up Ricin for his own terror campaign (his son was jailed for having copies of books you can get from Amazon, but that’s a different matter).

It would be nice to think that these events, and before that the decades long IRA campaign, would give we Brits a longer view on terrorism. It would be nice if everybody didn’t cry “Al Quaeda” before the evidence was in. But that’s not how it works. And that’s dangerous, as all the history we so quickly forget shows.

So my mockery of dumb, faith based* prejudices doesn’t seem as much fun now. Which means it’s even more important to continue. Luckily for me, God’s self appointed representative in Salford is back blogging after a hiatus. On Friday he decided to tell us what is wrong with modern Policing. Can you guess what the problem is? (Yes, you’re right, it’s homosexuals- or “homopervuals” as Carvath likes to say- with a side order women. It’s always homosexuals with Richard Carvath, he’s obsessed, and no amount of fantasising about having to save WPCs when “serious and organised” criminals come and kick in his door is going to make any of us think he’s not in denial.) At least some of the reactionaries are still good for a laugh.

A couple of more serious posts on this subject, by people who have stronger stomachs and have looked deeper into the abyss that is the reactionary belief system-

Where Worlds Collide: The Al-Queda of the West?

Little Green Footballs: The Oslo Terrorist’s ‘Counter-Jihad’ Ideology

*I don’t mean religion here, these guys cling to their beliefs in overarching conspiracies and impossibly complex plans with ill defined aims ever tighter when presented with evidence of how ludicrous they are. That sounds like blind faith to me.

14 thoughts on “The other extremists

  • Tim Hall

    Just to clarify – he’s not trying to defend Melanie Phillips but is worried she might try to shut down my blog because I called her a racist.

  • Stewart Cowan

    I assume that this is meant to read that I am NOT “going to take up arms against a sea of secular humanists any time soon”. To suggest that I am likely to pull off a major terror incident, especially after Norway, could land you in big trouble legally as well as make you look like a fool.

    I have called for trials for treason for Blair and Brown, not just for the gold sell-off, but for worse crimes against our country. You linked to my post about Labour’s deliberate agenda of social engineering to change the fabric of British society to make it less British. The death sentence is the traditional punishment for traitors. I am not suggesting something new – it was Labour who changed the law and no wonder – they aren’t stupid, despite first impressions.

    I don’t call for their “stringing up” without fair trials. As usual, you try to make out that I am saying something I am not.

    Maybe I am considered an “extremist”. That’s certainly what the government and media seem to want to portray patriots – those who defend (by way of words) our way of life and freedoms. I consider people like you to be extremist, and a danger to my freedom.

    One of the worst forms of “blind faith” is to believe the government, which, if it was a business, would have been closed down a long time ago for breaches of contract, mis-selling, providing substandard and dangerous goods, etc., etc.

    But it’s your prerogative to pay for shoddy goods and not complain!

    • Ian Pattinson

      Being unable to comprehend a fairly straight forward sentence, and making veiled threats of legal action based upon your incomprehension, could make you look like a fool.

      You can claim you’re calling for a fair trial on your trumped up charges of treason, but in your head Blair, Brown etc. are guilty and there’s already a latter day Pierrepoint measuring out the rope, so yes, you are fantasising about stringing them up. Anything other than a show trial would be laughed out of court anyway. Your killer evidence, to repeat an earlier assessment, is a misunderstanding of one person’s interpretation of what he thought his former employers may have been hoping would be the- ill defined, unmeasurable and generations away- long term secondary effect of a piece of legislation that was only ever going to last as long as the country’s economy was doing so well we needed to recruit more skilled workers than were locally available.

      You’re not a patriot, you’re just dressing up your hatred of others and claiming it’s patriotism or an expression of your borderline religious beliefs. You want to make up crimes and conspiracies and call for other people to be punished because of them. I may be at an extreme of ideology from you, but I’m not the one who’s views are based upon lies.

      And you really are an idiot if you think I’m a blind supporter of this or any government. I’ve been a vocal critic of all of them when they’ve done bad or stupid things. The difference is that my criticisms are based upon what they genuinely have done, stuff for which there is evidence, whereas you’re just angry because they’re not as racist, homophobic or religiously blinded as you.

      • Stewart Cowan

        Yes, I apologise, I misread what you wrote in my attempt to read your verbiage as quickly as possible.

        “Trumped up charges of treason”? William Joyce (Lord Haw-Haw) was hanged for far less grievous behaviour than some of our contemporary politicians.

        As I have said previously, Mr Neather’s admissions were not required to see exactly what has been going on.

        If I had any hatred, it would be reserved for the British people who have dumped on this country. If you think that someone can be a patriot while accepting a complete re-engineering of society and being incorporated into a globalist system of control then you are more stupid than I gave you credit for. Maybe you just need to overcome your programming and stop using doublethink.

        “you’re just angry because they’re not as racist, homophobic or religiously blinded as you.”

        This is the kind of ignorant phraseology I associate you with.

        • Ian Pattinson

          Trumped up. You really don’t have any evidence to support your claims of treason, so, yes, trumped up. Your discomfort at seeing a few more brown faces and hearing a wider range of accents isn’t evidence.

          Populations change over time. There are many competing factors affecting who moves where, when, whether they breed and who with. Obviously you don’t like the changes, and this fantasy global agenda is your reaction. (I’ve yet to see you explain what this conspiracy is beyond the occasional bit of hand waving and maybe uttering “Bilderberg”. Give me some details.

          Who is running this global conspiracy?

          Why are they running it?

          What do they hope to achieve?

          What’s the timescale?

          So you can say what you like about people and accuse them of all sorts of unfounded crimes, but when someone speaks as they find about you you get offended. A bit thin skinned aren’t you?

          • Richard Carvath

            Not that I’m Stewart Cowan’s spokesman Ian, but if you want to learn about global conspiracy for one world government, I’d recommend studying the work of Gary Kah. Kah’s work is not to be dismissed lightly.

            (I will expect you Ian to reply and rubbish Kah in a few short sentences – which is your prerogative – just as you deny everything you either don’t understand or don’t like to accept, but the truth is that Kah’s evidence is compelling and his analysis well reasoned.)

          • Ian Pattinson

            I had a look at Kah’s website, and his answer to the One World Government is for everyone to become his flavour of Christian. To save you from a monolithic world government he wants you to pledge allegiance to a monolithic world religion. You understand that getting everyone to pray to the same god would be the perfect first step towards setting up a New World Order- tell them all that they’re working for their freedom if they follow your orders without question. Only one thing in history has come close to being a conspiracy for global domination on the scale Stewart and you worry about. That thing is religion.

            If there is a conspiracy to create a World Government then it’s being organised by a church. How does it feel to be part of the problem and have fallen for the big lie?

            If you could present me with something new then I’d take the time to examine it before responding. But you don’t, you haven’t produced a new argument in ages. If you’re too lazy to come up with anything of substance then I shall not waste more than a sentence at a time pointing out that you are still wrong.

          • Richard Carvath

            I think you’re absolutely right about one thing Ian.

            You wrote: “Only one thing in history has come close to being a conspiracy for global domination… That thing is religion.”

            I won’t waste my time introducing Christian wisdom about spiritual realm realities to you here, but – though you think in terms of “religion” – you are actually barking up the right tree in that the fundamental medium of global conspiracy is the spiritual realm.

            Now I’m going to cheekily borrow your quote Ian and change just one word to point out the particular religion which is the key player in global conspiracy…

            “Only one thing in history has come close to being a conspiracy for global domination… That thing is Freemasonry.”

          • Ian Pattinson

            Freemasonry’s a religion now? I know it dresses itself up in occult mumbo-jumbo, but does that really qualify it?

            All religions practise the sorts of trickery Stewart accuses his imagined conspiracies of. There’s manipulation of the masses to the benefit of a select few, indoctrination and brain washing, lies and propaganda and corruption of the political classes. Different religions at different times and in different places, but they’re all guilty of it to some extent.

            Freemasonry may be corrupt and conniving. It may even be a religion. But it’s not, whatever you may want to believe, the only one guilty of conspiracy.

  • Richard Carvath

    Hi Ian,

    I hope you are well. It may interest you to know that I’ve become a regular cyclist in the last year – inspired in part by your example.

    I’m afraid my lack of time prevents me from getting into a lengthy exchange with you on this comment-thread, but I would just like to point out a couple of things for balance:

    (1) Islamic terrorism is far and away the largest and most potent terror threat to the UK at the present time; I assume you accept this as fact (the British security services do);

    (2) You might like to consider for yourself why homopervuals were once banned from the police and the armed forces, and why women were once restricted to non-combatant roles in the armed forces and to low-risk duties in the police. Considering both homopervuals and women together – the issues included blackmail, security of information and other security related issues, morale, trust, efficiency, effectiveness, safety, and the welfare of young children with a mother in a dangerous occupation. You might also like to consider for yourself why when what I stand for was the order of the day, we were a safer, less violent, more civilised and more prosperous nation.

    Ian, you can mock social conservatives all you like, but you cannot deny that my moral standards are the rock-solid standards of Great Britain, whilst your secular humanist values are the sandy values of Broken Britain.

    As for the person calling Melanie Phillips a racist, what a bizarre and disgusting insult to Melanie.

    • Ian Pattinson

      1) Islamic terrorism is a threat, but it’s not the only one- which is the point of my post. The media and too many politicians are wilfully ignorant of the fact that there are other extremists. I see that Stewart and you are already trying to distance yourselves from the Norway idiot (I’m calling him this after a suggetsion a friend made on facebook), even though you share far too many of his his stated values and beliefs.

      2) Homosexuals and women used to be kept out of certain jobs because we used to be a stupider society. Luckily we’ve grown up. Most of us, anyway. Blackmail and the security issues were only a problem when homosexuality was illegal. Morale, trust, efficiency, effectiveness and safety are greatly improved if people don’t have to lie about themselves just so they can do the job they want to. And what about the welfare of children with fathers in a dangerous occupation? When the values you stand for were the order of the day this was a nastier, less prosperous country. You claim that the state of policing has been getting worse since the mid nineties, but I found statistics that showed crime peaking in the mid nineties and dropping consistently since then. Things have been getting better since exactly the time when you think they’ve been getting worse. You could have found this out with about ten minutes searching on the internet- I did- but I understand that you don’t want the truth to get in the way of your delusions.

      Your values- intolerance, bigotry and scapegoating of people different to you- are the ones which are broken. If Britain is to become a better place it needs less religion, and the intolerance it fosters, and more humanism.

      I avoid Melanie Philips, but from what I’ve seen of her, she is quite bizarre and disgusting.

  • Richard Carvath

    Well Ian, I expected that sort of a response from you! You are true to form.

    I would actually like to have a good old debate with you over the points you raise here, but frustratingly I simply can’t commit the time.

    I would just like to say a couple of things…

    (1) I can’t say I care very much for being compared with a neo-Nazi mass murderer! I have written two blog-posts about Anders Behring Breivik this week; I believe Breivik’s sane, evil, a neo-Nazi (not a Christian) and he ought to be executed.

    (2) Be very careful with crime statistics.

    P.S. Melanie Phillips rocks!

    • Ian Pattinson

      1) If you don’t want to be compared with the Norway idiot then you need to reassess your stance on just about everything, because you come out with some ridiculous statements that sound like the sorts of things he believes. Calling him a Nazi is a lazy way of avoiding examining his beliefs and seeing how they compare to your own. Whatever is going on in his head is far more complex than that. Luckily, he’s going to spend the rest of his life in prison where experts can assess his reasoning and just how contorted it is.

      Calling for the death penalty for him is missing the point horribly. Norway is a civilised and mature country and doesn’t have the death penalty. He wanted to make Norway a nastier country and drag it backwards. Judicially killing him would give him what he wants. Better to sentence him under the existing system and keep him informed of all the advances in tolerance and cooperation which are happening that his actions completely failed to stop. To show him that he utterly failed would be a far more fitting punishment than sinking to his level.

      2) You know something about crime statistics the rest of us don’t? Please do share.

      Melanie Philips doesn’t rock. She panders, telling you what you want to hear even though it’s all lies.

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